15 July 2014
- Mary Wong
The next Privacy & Proxy Services Accreditation Issues PDP WG teleconference is scheduled for Tuesday 15 July 2014 at 1400 UTC
07:00 PDT, 10:00 EDT, 15:00 London, 16:00 CET
For other times: http://tinyurl.com/mo8nyhj
Adobe Connect WITH AUDIO enabled: https://icann.adobeconnect.com/ppsai/
Agenda:
- Roll Call/Updates to SOI
- Complete discussion on D-4
- Commence deliberations on E-1
- Next steps/next meeting
Documents for Review:
PPSAI Category D - Question 4 - 9 July 2014
PPSAI - Category E - Question 1 - 7 July 2014
PPSAI - Category E - Question 2 - 14 July 2014
MP3 Recording: http://audio.icann.org/gnso/gnso-ppsa-20140715-en.mp3
Meeting Transcript: http://gnso.icann.org/en/meetings/transcript-ppsa-15jul14-en.pdf
Attendees:
Steve Metalitz - IPC
Justin Macy – BC
Sarah Wyld - RrSG
Chris Pelling – RrSG
Darcy Southwell - RrSG
Graeme Bunton – RrSG
Don Blumenthal – RySG
Val Sherman – IPC
Griffin Barnett – IPC
Susan Kawaguchi – BC
Kathy Kleiman – NCUC
Stephanie Perrin – NCSG
James Bladel – RrSG
David Hea sley – IPC
Alex Deacon - IPC
Jim Bikoff – IPC
Osvaldo Novoa – ISPCP
Kristina Rosette – IPC
Paul McGrady – IPC
Carlton Samuels – ALAC
Todd Williams – IPC
Dan Burke – Individual
Laura Jedeed – BC
Chris Chaplow – BC
Libby Baney – BC
Tim Ruiz - RrSG
Christian Dawson - ISPCP
Apologies:
Susan Prosser- RrSG
Michele Neylon – RrSG
Holly Raiche - ALAC
ICANN staff:
Marika Konings
Mary Wong
Nathalie Peregrine
Adobe Connect chat transcript for Tuesday 15 July 2014:
Marika Konings:Welcome to the PPSAI WG Meeting of 15 July 2014
Chris Pelling:afternoon all
Chris Pelling:just waiting for someone to pick the phone up
Mary Wong:Hi Chris - yes there seems to be a short delay there; hang on.
Nathalie Peregrine:Chris & Mary, I have informed the operator
Mary Wong:Thanks, Nathalie - I'm on now
Nathalie Peregrine:Excellent, you are both on!
Chris Pelling:well I think I am on now, all quiet :p
Chris Pelling:touch wood someone heard that :)
Chris Pelling:aha
Nathalie Peregrine:We heard you Chris :)
Bladel:Waiting for the operator
Nathalie Peregrine:James, Ive informed the operator
Kathy:still holding...
steve metalitz:A coordinator will assist me momentarily....
Kathy:But can hear you Don, loud and clear
Sarah Wyld - Aplus.net:Hi, I'm also waiting for an operator.
Nathalie Peregrine:The telecom providers do tend to experience heavy call traffic at the top of the hour
Bladel:If your browser supports it, yep. :)
Kathy:I'm in!
Val Sherman:Good morning
Val Sherman:David Heasley is also on the call
Don Blumenthal:I didn't know that some browsers have difficulties
Griffin Barnett:David Heasley from our office is also on the call, thanks
Nathalie Peregrine:Thanks noted!
Nathalie Peregrine:Paul McGrady has also joined the call
Tim Ruiz:Could not hear Steve.
Nathalie Peregrine:Alex Deacon and Christian Dawson have joined the call
Nathalie Peregrine:Susan Kawaguchi has joined the call
Nathalie Peregrine:David Cake has joined the call
Mary Wong:In the RAA P/P temp spec, there's this language: Unless prohibited by law, P/P Provider shall promptly (within five (5) business days) relay or forward all allegations of malicious conduct, cybersquatting, and other illegal activities to the P/P Customer, except in instances the P/P Provider is notified that the relay of such allegations may jeopardize an ongoing civil or criminal investigation
Paul McGrady:Steve is extremly hard to hear.
Tim Ruiz:Can barely hear Steve.
Mary Wong:(oops sorry for nasty formatting)
Don Blumenthal:Mary, the excerpt is unreadable in my chat window
Nathalie Peregrine:I have asked the operator to increase volume on Steve's line
Nathalie Peregrine:Stephanie Perrin has joined the call
Nathalie Peregrine:Carlton Samuels has joined the call
Carlton:Morning all
Kathy:I have the same question - what limits do some p/p impose on Relay - and why?
Kathy:Morning Carlton!
Tim Ruiz:It may be different from Proxy versus non-proxy.
Kathy:@Tim: how so?
Carlton:@Kathy Question re limts on relay and why...+1
Mary Wong:OK trying again: Unless prohibited by law, P/P Provider shall promptly (within five (5) business days) relay or forward all allegations of malicious conduct, cybersquatting, and other illegal activities to the P/P Customer, except in instances the P/P Provider is notified that the relay of such allegations may jeopardize an ongoing civil or criminal investigation.
Tim Ruiz:In Proxy the provider considered the registrant
Mary Wong:That's Section 3.4 of the temp P/P spec from the 2013 RAA.
Tim Ruiz:or may be considered the registrant.
Carlton:@Mary: So current rule limit relay only with respect of jeopardy for legal proceedings. Is that decision left to judgment of p/p provider or is there some objective standard?
Mary Wong:My apologies - something dropped out of my comment. I meant to note that 3.4 was in an earlier version of the P/P spec but did not seem to make it into the final document.
Don Blumenthal:Carlston, I thnk that's part of what we have to decide.
Mary Wong:@Don, exactly.
Carlton:@Don thanks...
steve metalitz:DBP allows customer to choose "relay everything"
Stephanie Perrin:The problem is, if we use squishy language, we then merely punt the problem over to the service provider
Chris Pelling:we use our own privacy service, which essentially will forward ANY email as long as the instructions are followed AND you do the reply mail to the correct address (which cheanges daily) within 24 hours
Stephanie Perrin:I think Susan is making my point...
Chris Pelling:now if LEA contacts us directly, without going through the P/P service thats up to us to forward
Nathalie Peregrine:Osvaldo Novoa has joined the call
Bladel::)
Osvaldo Novoa:Sorry I am late, was delayed in aprevious meeting
Tim Ruiz:Spam filters may be applied pre or post control of the P/P Provider.
Justin Macy:@Mary I noticed that LegitScript's comments aren't included in the comments section at the bottom of the page. Is this an ommision, or did LS not respond to this question?
Tim Ruiz:+1 David
Kathy:And a quick note that we have heard in past discussions that one of the reasons people register as p/p is to prevent spam....
Marika Konings:Hi Justin - the original survey question combined reveal and relay - as your comments focused more specifically on reveal, it will show up in the templates for the next category.
Marika Konings:I'll send you the response off-list so you can let me know if you would like any part of it included as part of the next iteration of the template.
Justin Macy:Great. Thank you!
Susan kawaguchi:agree with James I am not advocating to make the PP responsible for the licensee to respond to anything
Graeme Bunton:Sensible, James.
Kathy:I like James' idea of some flexibility in this process. Some p/p will provide more; some less. but a baseline set here.
Chris Pelling::@steve, its probably automatic relay, I doubt someone actually sits there going through emails, could be wrong mind you
Libby Baney:Good point Steve
Kathy:As discussed earlier, I often get multiple calls by telephone that constitute harrassment, even though they allege that there is something I should be doing...
Tim Ruiz:How does the provider figure out when complaints etc. are not reponded to?
Graeme Bunton:can't be done, Tim
steve metalitz:@Tim, it would be up to complainant to document that. "This complaint has been sent for relay X times and no response received.
Tim Ruiz:Thanks Steve.
Bladel:Sorry, but I need to drop and head to the airport.
Chris Pelling:well surely thats up to the complainant if they want to respond
Chris Pelling:I do not get the login on that, if they dont want to respond, what are you going to do, demand their private info and then send snailmail ?
Chris Pelling:lofin=logic
Chris Pelling:crumbs - you know what I meant :)
Don Blumenthal:Chris, we must be getting near the end of the call. :)
Kathy:Agree with Susan that the tracking of the response -- and the underlying issue - runs with the Requestor
Justin Macy:+1 Susan
Chris Pelling:by phone cannot be handled
Kathy:Is that a RELAY question?
Chris Pelling:as there is no chain
Graeme Bunton:Agreed with Chris
Tim Ruiz:No
Paul McGrady:Agree with Todd. Important issue to discuss during reveal conversation.
steve metalitz:Agree with Todd re relevance of multiple relays without response.
Kristina Rosette 2:sorry. have to drop. will catch up on transcript
Tim Ruiz:Agree with Chris regarding phone calls.
Dan Burke:Thanks for including me :)
Graeme Bunton:It IS good to get some LEA perspective directly, thank you Dan.
Mary Wong:We'll update the template with summaries of today's discussion.
Tim Ruiz:Thanks Don, bye all.
Paul McGrady:Thanks Don!
Mary Wong:Thank you Don and all!
Chris Pelling:Thanks all