4 March 2014

The next  Privacy & Proxy Services Accreditation Issues PDP WG teleconference is scheduled for Tuesday 04 March 2014 at 1500 UTC (07:00 PST, 10:00 EST, 15:00 London, 16:00 CET).

Adobe Connect WITH AUDIO enabled: https://icann.adobeconnect.com/ppsai/

Agenda: 

1. Roll call/SOI updates (3 mins)
2. Presentations on P/P services and different business models (30 mins)
3. Last call for finalization of template on Category B Question 1 (7 mins)
4. Continuation of discussion of template on Category B Question 2 (15 mins)
5. Planning for Singapore (5 mins)

Questions from last week for further discussion (Cat B Question 2):

• What would be the arguments for not using the same standards / requirements for validation and verification as per the 2013 RAA?
• Should there be a requirement for re-verification, and if so, what instances would trigger such re-verification?
• In case of affiliation between the P/P service and the registrar, if the registration information has already been verified by the registrar, should this exempt the P/P provider from doing so?
• Should the same requirements apply to privacy and proxy services or is there a reason to distinguish between the two?

Documents for Review: 

• Updated Template for Cat B Question 1
• Updated Template for Cat B Question 2

Other Information:

• Nominet Input to Whois Review Team
• NORC Study on on Whois Data Accuracy (2010) - note that methodology for P/P services is specifically outlined in Appendix 3.

MP3 Recording: http://audio.icann.org/gnso/gnso-ppsa-20140304-en.mp3

Meeting Transcript: http://gnso.icann.org/en/meetings/transcript-ppsa-04mar14-en.pdf

Attendees: 

Luc Seufer - RrSG

Volker Greimann - RrSG

Graeme Bunton – RrSG

Tim Ruiz – RrSG

Sarah Wyld – RrSG

David Heasley - IPC

James Bladel - RrSG

Steve Metalitz - IPC

Kathy Kleiman – RySGgr

Justin Macy - BC

Darcy Southwell - RrSG

Alex Deacon - IPC

Todd Williams – IPC

Don Blumenthal - RySG

Libby Baney - BC

Phil Marano – IPC

Jim Bikoff – IPC

Griffin Barnett - IPC

Roy Balleste – NCUC

Amr Elsadr - NCUC

Kiran Malancharuvil – IPC

David Cake - NCSG

Valeriya Sherman – IPC

Marie-Laure Lemineur – NPOC

John Horton – BC

Stephanie Perrin – NCSG

Michele Neylon – RrSG

Jennifer Standiford – RrSG

Carlton Samuels – ALAC

Maria Farrell – NCUC 

Apologies:

Paul McGrady

Tobias Sattler - RrSG

Marika Konings – staff

Joe Catapano - staff

ICANN staff:

Mary Wong

Margie Milam

Amy Bivins

Mike Zupke

Terri Agnew

Nathalie Peregrine

Adobe Connect chat transcript for Tuesday 04 March 2014:

  Terri Agnew:Welcome to the PPSAI WG Meeting on 04 March 2014

  Volker Greimann:Hi Mary, hi Terri

  Terri Agnew:Hello Volker

  Mary Wong:Welcome, Volker!

  Volker Greimann:can you turn on microphone connection on the adobe?

  Nathalie  Peregrine:Apologies Volker, done now!

  Kathy Kleiman:Hi All!

  Mary Wong:Welcome everyone; good morning/afternoon/evening all!

  Nathalie  Peregrine:Marie-Laure Lemineur and Michele Neylon have joined the call

  Mary Wong:FYI we have "un-sync'ed" the slides so you can scroll up and down on your own screen using the arrow keys.

  Terri Agnew:Jim Bikoff has joined audio

  Terri Agnew:David Cake has joined audio

  Terri Agnew:Amr Elsadr has joined

  Terri Agnew:Kiran Malancharuvil has joined

  Terri Agnew:Jennifer Standiford has joined

  Kathy Kleiman:Tx you Volker!

  Michele Neylon:Can anyone hear him?

  Mary Wong:Yes - are you able to, Michele?

  Don Blumenthal:I can

  Michele Neylon:hmmm

  Michele Neylon:I'll dial in

  Terri Agnew:Michele - Let me know if you need us to dial out to you

  Volker Greimann:yup, we do that too, left that out

  Terri Agnew:Michele - I don't see your mic is active on adobe connect

  Kathy Kleiman:Tx you Graeme!

  Volker Greimann:If anyone is interested, our service is located at whoisproxy.org

  Michele Neylon:Terri - I didn't want to speak

  Amr Elsadr::)

  Graeme Bunton:Our terms are here: https://contactprivacy.com/?action=wp_mailer_show_terms

  Terri Agnew:Phil Marano has joined

  Graeme Bunton:thx James

  Kathy Kleiman:Tx James!

  Amr Elsadr:Thanks James.

  Bladel:DBP Terms of Service:  https://www.domainsbyproxy.com/policy/ShowDoc.aspx?pageid=domain_nameproxy

  Libby Baney:Thanks to all speakers

  Carlton Samuels:Hi everbyody

  Terri Agnew:Carlton I have you noted on attendance

  Carlton Samuels:Thks Terri. Apologies for late connection; intervening priority needed attention

  Kiran Malancharuvil:Steve, I Can barely hear you, can you speak up?

  Kathy Kleiman:Sorry, but can't hear you Steve.

  Tim Ruiz:Can Steve speak up please?

  Luc Seufer:can't hear Steve

  Kiran Malancharuvil:I think maybe someone else isn't on mute?

  Carlton Samuels:Yes, much better

  Kiran Malancharuvil:better

  Terri Agnew:I am asking op to increase his volume

  Volker Greimann:I can answer Steve

  Michele Neylon:we're not obliged to

  Michele Neylon:not sure what he's asking

  Michele Neylon:we are obliged to check email or phone

  Michele Neylon:under 2013

  Michele Neylon:(we aren't on 2013)

  Luc Seufer:this is how we handleit http://help.eurodns.com/customer/portal/articles/1439035-what-is-the-contact-validation-policy-

  Luc Seufer:(we don't offer p/p services ourselves)

  Carlton Samuels:@Volker: To be sure, IF there is a problem with the domain in your case it is the registrar that initiaites contact with the registrant of record, not the p/p provider?

  Graeme Bunton:also, to be clear, we don't offer our service to other registrars. 

  Graeme Bunton:Domains need to be in OpenSRS

  Bladel:Not applicable in Arizona. :)

  steve metalitz:QUESTION for James, Volker, Graeme:  Are Whois rdata eminders sent annually to p/p cusomters, and if so by whom (registrar or p/pp provider).?  

  Bladel:Good question, I'll have to check that one.

  Libby Baney:Stephanie - could you share a cite to the Canada law you mentioned?

  Stephanie Perrin:Sure, I will do it via email if that is ok....

  steve metalitz:Sorry for typos:  "customer" and "p/p provider"

  Libby Baney:Thanks, that'd be great!

  Graeme Bunton:Steve - i am reasonably sure they are sent to p/p customers, and I believe that they are sent by the registrar

  Graeme Bunton:will confirm

  Kathy Kleiman:+1 Michele

  Amr Elsadr:+1 Michele. :)

  Libby Baney:Question to Volker -- you mentioned your service finds it an abuse of the service for use of domains for commercial purposes. May I ask, how do you define "commercial" in this context?

  Michele Neylon:only .cat and .tel

  Michele Neylon:in gtlds

  Stephanie Perrin:@Volker...given current sentiment about global privacy, seems like a good time to take a few cases to Court. :-)

  Michele Neylon:hinted?

  Michele Neylon:German understatement at its finest

  Amr Elsadr:Isn't there the ICANN procedure for handling whois conflict with privacy laws? Why don't registrars use it?

  Carlton Samuels:@Michele: The ICANN response has always been the registrant makes an agreement to publish when they buy the domain. The question has always been informed consent and whether it is given.  Have to say in support of what you say  we now have a better understanding of  the relationship between data privacy law and WHOIS.

  Michele Neylon:Amr - it's broken

  Michele Neylon:Carlton - it needs to be fixed

  Volker Greimann:The devil will skate to work before that happens

  Volker Greimann:(ICANN looking into privacy)

  Luc Seufer:This is how we are dealing that

  Luc Seufer:The Customer understands and accepts that in the case of denial of the disclosure specified herein, the Domain Name Service cannot be provided and that any request to delete the Personal Data after the registration of the Domain Name will automatically entail the deletion of the Domain Name.

  Carlton Samuels:@Michele: No question about that! And a holistic fix is the preferred approach

  Amr Elsadr:@Michele: I hope you can explain to me why it's broken some time.

  Volker Greimann:I have started on the surveymonkey, but it just never ends...

  maria farrell:hi all, sorry to be joining for the last few minutes. IETF week in London coinciding with Too Much Work!

  Luc Seufer:same as Volker. I'll need to open a good bottle of wine and sit down for 2 hours to complete it. ;-)

  Stephanie Perrin:@Carlton, agreed....and sorry to repeat the harangue I have been on in the EWG, but in Canada that would be a coerced consent, and not acceptable under 4.3.3 of the Schedule to the Act

  Michele Neylon:Amr - it's very simple, - look at the current process - read it and if you can't see why it's broken I can explain it :)

  Amr Elsadr:OK. Thanks Michele. :)

  steve metalitz:@Kathy, what is missing from the B.1 summary?   As distinct from B.2 where there has been a lot of  list activity re B.2.  

  Luc Seufer:@stephanie  you are welcome to register a .fr domain name  where your right to privacy will be respected. 

  Luc Seufer:until ICANN acknowledges local laws, ccTLDs are the way to go.

  Michele Neylon:She can't register a .fr or a .eu

  Michele Neylon:due to nexus requirements

  Michele Neylon:stop teasing her!

  Kathy Kleiman:My concern is much more for the next table we look at...

  Mary Wong:This template is similar to what has been used to collate, review and respond to public comments by other WGs. We most definitely will include ALL responses received for the WG to review again.

  Luc Seufer:I am ready to act as proxy for her !

  Terri Agnew:Maria Farrell has joined

  Stephanie Perrin:@Luc, maybe I will register the french versions of my domains there, thanks:-)...or move to Tucows and drive Graeme nuts with complaints.....

  Bladel:Need to drop, thanks everyone.

  Graeme Bunton:@Stephanie I can recommend lots of wonderful other registrars.

  Tim Ruiz:Need to go. Thanks Don an all!

  maria farrell:I support the idea of talking to cc's - they have a variety of approaches to these things, though luckily only one set of laws to comply with !

  Graeme Bunton:Blacknight for example would love to have your domains.

  Tim Ruiz:@Maria +1

  maria farrell:Michele yo uhave all my hosting already!

  Michele Neylon:Maria - )

  maria farrell:;-)

  Michele Neylon::)

  Volker Greimann:thank you Mary

  maria farrell:thanks everyone. talk next week.

  Luc Seufer:@ Maria apparently you are not complaining enough

  Kiran Malancharuvil:thanks Don. 

  maria farrell:heehee luc

  maria farrell:bye all

  Justin Macy:bye

  Luc Seufer:bye

  Carlton Samuels:Bye all

  Carlton Samuels:Great discussion

  Carlton Samuels:Grist for the EWG mill

  Mary Wong:Thanks everyone.