AC Chat: 2019-02-27 Consolidated Policy Working Group Call
- Andrea Glandon
- Aleksey Khapchenko
- Yesim Saglam
Ā Yesim Nazlar: (2/27/2019 15:27) Welcome to the At-Large Consolidated Policy Working Group (CPWG) Call taking place on Wednesday, 27 February 2019 13:00 UTC
Ā Ā Yesim Nazlar: (15:27) Agenda:Ā https://icann-community.atlassian.net/wiki/x/5RTwBQ
Ā Ā Antonio Medina GĆ³mez ACUI: (15:41) buenos dĆas a todos
Ā Ā Yesim Nazlar: (15:44) Welcome Antonio
Ā Ā Yesim Nazlar: (15:44) We have ES channel available for this call. ADIGO ES:1738
Ā Ā Yesim Nazlar: (15:44) Please let me know if you need a dial-out. Thank you
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (15:56) Hi folks.
Ā Ā Evin ErdoÄdu: (15:59) Hello all, welcome.
Ā Ā Jonathan Zuck: (16:01) I take no prisoners
Ā Ā Alberto Soto: (16:01) Hello everyone!
Ā Ā Evin ErdoÄdu: (16:02) Prepare for ICANN64 by reviewing the Pre-ICANN64 Policy Report, now available here >>Ā https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__go.icann.org_2H45M0L&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=mrDeztziKLa7gZqGADzxcnHA3QXmXYsnChWYBR4NElI&m=MIuCqfEB5Xj-Wwo1B5LgQG1hcLuu8DeM2JsU1oMWq4I&s=oxPKoHZIv-ILsZipL6Eao7jvASqcy5PAZXUynZviJzI&e=
Ā Ā Abdeldjalil Bachar Bong: (16:03) hello All
Ā Ā Abdeldjalil Bachar Bong: (16:03) Thanks @Evin for the report
Ā Ā Evin ErdoÄdu: (16:05) Most welcome Abdeldjalil!Ā
Ā Ā Alan Greenberg: (16:07) No understandable.- echo
Ā Ā Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@CLO3): (16:08) repeat, Yes please
Ā Ā Maureen Hilyard: (16:08) Thanks Daniel
Ā Ā Evin ErdoÄdu: (16:09) ALAC Position on Government Engagement Approach (blog):Ā https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.icann.org_news_blog_icann-2Dorg-2Dpublishes-2Dcharter-2Don-2Dgovernment-2Dengagement-2Dapproach&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=mrDeztziKLa7gZqGADzxcnHA3QXmXYsnChWYBR4NElI&m=MIuCqfEB5Xj-Wwo1B5LgQG1hcLuu8DeM2JsU1oMWq4I&s=rt1bOB-jieN1rnn6LiowdY3JLXO8ICN58k8QBEXvdyI&e=
Ā Ā Evin ErdoÄdu: (16:10) *Government Engagement Approach (blog):Ā https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.icann.org_news_blog_icann-2Dorg-2Dpublishes-2Dcharter-2Don-2Dgovernment-2Dengagement-2Dapproach&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=mrDeztziKLa7gZqGADzxcnHA3QXmXYsnChWYBR4NElI&m=MIuCqfEB5Xj-Wwo1B5LgQG1hcLuu8DeM2JsU1oMWq4I&s=rt1bOB-jieN1rnn6LiowdY3JLXO8ICN58k8QBEXvdyI&e=
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (16:11) That blog post claims that ICANN doesn't do lobbying. "we will not be lobbying." However, note the following page:Ā https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.icann.org_resources_pages_lobbying-2Ddisclosures-2Dcontributions-2D2015-2D11-2D18-2Den&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=mrDeztziKLa7gZqGADzxcnHA3QXmXYsnChWYBR4NElI&m=MIuCqfEB5Xj-Wwo1B5LgQG1hcLuu8DeM2JsU1oMWq4I&s=n0dpo3ALYxsD2-T-8gb0x-G_g44e7FXEjgax4UtuxQk&e=Ā Ā Hard to reconcile those!
Ā Ā Maria Korniiets: (16:16) Sorry had connection problems :(
Ā Ā Alan Greenberg: (16:17) Perhaps not wanting to repeat the GDPR fiasco?
Ā Ā Jonathan Zuck: (16:20) @
Ā Ā Jonathan Zuck: (16:20) @Alan, by doing less?
Ā Ā Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@CLO3): (16:22) These concerns were raised in the CCWG on Orgnaisational Acccountability in the Transparancy Review Team discussion so I read this as part of the 'Implementation' by ICANN of recommendations the COmmunity has made in recent times.
Ā Ā Jonathan Zuck: (16:23) that's why it feels a bit more like a new policy than a clarification
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (16:23) Eduardo was referencing this page:Ā https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.icann.org_resources_pages_lobbying-2Ddisclosures-2Dcontributions-2D2015-2D11-2D18-2Den&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=mrDeztziKLa7gZqGADzxcnHA3QXmXYsnChWYBR4NElI&m=MIuCqfEB5Xj-Wwo1B5LgQG1hcLuu8DeM2JsU1oMWq4I&s=n0dpo3ALYxsD2-T-8gb0x-G_g44e7FXEjgax4UtuxQk&e=
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (16:23) (reposting in case it scrolled off the page)
Ā Ā Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@CLO3): (16:23) During the JPA, the Affirmation of Commitments and IANA TransitionĀ Ā ICANN did need to have an active 'lobby' effort .... dare I say **obviously**Ā Ā so these mandatory declarations are both correct and valid IMOĀ
Ā Ā Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@CLO3): (16:24) and IF/when the ORG needed to "lobby"Ā Ā it would transparantly be declared in this way as well
Ā Ā Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@CLO3): (16:25) clarification will be appreciatedĀ Ā on this Leon though thanks
Ā Ā Bastiaan Goslings: (16:26) 'ĆCANN org engagement (...)Ā Ā will be limited to providing technical information on the impact on ICANNās Mission or Articles of Incorporation (āICANNImpactā)
Ā Ā Bastiaan Goslings: (16:26) Sounds like lobbying to me
Ā Ā Bastiaan Goslings: (16:26) which is fine
Ā Ā Bastiaan Goslings: (16:26) But good to frame it explicitly, limit it, and be transparant
Ā Ā Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@CLO3): (16:27) it is also something that is clearly in the Remit of ICANN Mission as well @Bastiaan
Ā Ā Bastiaan Goslings: (16:27) Yes agree
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (16:27) +1 Bastiaan. And have disclosures for all countries, not just the US mandatory disclosures.
Ā Ā Bastiaan Goslings: (16:28) @George: yes I agree
Ā Ā Jonathan Zuck: (16:28) because platforms are under fire right now
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (16:29) It's naive to think that "technical" info doesn't overlap with political or legislative matters, or are always "neutral".
Ā Ā Bastiaan Goslings: (16:29) 'And have disclosures for all countries, not just the US mandatory disclosures.'Ā Ā - that seems to be the intent of the charter as I read it
Ā Ā Jonathan Zuck: (16:29) yep
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (16:30) +1 (who is speaking right now? Good to say one's name before speaking, for transcripts, etc.)
Ā Ā Jonathan Zuck: (16:30) Alan Greenberg
Ā Ā Bartlett Morgan: (16:31) its Alan
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (16:31) Thanks Jonathan.
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (16:31) and Bartlett.
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (16:31) (I don't recognize everyone's voice, yet, but will over time) :-)
Ā Ā hadia Elminiawi: (16:32) so I am now on adobe as wellĀ Ā :)
Ā Ā A-Eduardo: (16:32) or maybe use a different set of words
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (16:32) Their own letter says there are "local definitions of lobbying"
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (16:33) So, which definition are they using? "-)
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (16:33) :-)
Ā Ā Bastiaan Goslings: (16:33) 'we will not be lobbying' is mentioned in the blogpost, not in the (draft) charter
Ā Ā Alan Greenberg: (16:33) @Leon, I think that "no lobbying" is actually an ICANN Board issue, and not and ICANN Org issue.
Ā Ā Jonathan Zuck: (16:33) this is all about figuring out what org can do autonomously I think
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (16:34) @Bastiaan: true, but I read "government engagement" to often be "lobbying"
Ā Ā Bastiaan Goslings: (16:34) I agree with you, George
Ā Ā Bastiaan Goslings: (16:34) So for that part in the blog is somewhat confusing
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (16:34) Each time they use the word "engagement" in that charter, one might argue it's "lobbying".
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (16:35) (draft charter, rather)
Ā Ā Bastiaan Goslings: (16:35) yep - and FWIW I do not have a problem with the lobbying activities as proposed in the draft charter
Ā Ā Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@CLO3): (16:35) to quote the Charter...Ā Ā As part of ICANN orgās work to identify Proposals, ICANN will continue to follow the development of legislation and standards-setting work. If the ICANN community is aware of Proposals for which ICANN org could consider engagement, those items can be flagged by the community to ICANN orgās Government Engagement team; Global Stakeholder Engagement team and through trackingfeedback@icann.org.ICANN will also continue to coordinate and collaborate, where appropriate, with theother I* organizations to help identify Proposals, as well as to understand other engagement work already underway on such Proposals.
Ā Ā Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@CLO3): (16:36) part of the DRAFT
Ā Ā Bartlett Morgan: (16:36) my only concern - the draft charter doesn't speak to the role of the community in helping set the agenda. Saying we can flag proposals seems a tad loose
Ā Ā Jonathan Zuck: (16:37) agree @Bartlett
Ā Ā Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@CLO3): (16:37) Remember the Communinty via CCWG-Accountability demanded that ICANN clearly worked *within* its mission, mandate and parameters...
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (16:37) As an example, suppose Australia asks to reduce the encryption strength of DNSSEC for signing of the root. Is that "technical" or "political" / "legislative"?
Ā Ā Bastiaan Goslings: (16:38) @Bartlett: I see your point but it's ICANN the org we're talking
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (16:38)Ā https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.wired.com_story_australia-2Dencryption-2Dlaw-2Dglobal-2Dimpact_&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=mrDeztziKLa7gZqGADzxcnHA3QXmXYsnChWYBR4NElI&m=MIuCqfEB5Xj-Wwo1B5LgQG1hcLuu8DeM2JsU1oMWq4I&s=dkGwQ5dSbMqEmWsHrBvDQMY9R84sHrjmTGtn7HTfet4&e=Ā (for context)
Ā Ā Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@CLO3): (16:38) but we need to raise this concerns and needs for clarification in our response (and I guess we **will** be making them) to this draft
Ā Ā Abdeldjalil Bachar Bong: (16:39) what is the next Step of the Bureau of Veni Markovski based in New York, and is responsible for the relations with the United Nations, the UN Agencies in New York, and the Permanent Missions to the United Nations.
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (16:39) (although, technically that's more for "signing" in DNSSEC, rather than "encryption", strictly speaking)
Ā Ā Jonathan Zuck: (16:39) well we can still "comment" via correspondence or "advice"
Ā Ā Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@CLO3): (16:41) @GeorgeĀ Ā our efforts as part of the Internet Community in AU to this more than dissapointing and poor/faulty legislation, was extensive via our ALSĀ Ā (makes sense but not in the name of ICANN but as Internet Australia, and we DID have excellent support from ISOC... which seems reasonable , we did not utalise any direct interaction that could be seen as resultant from ICANN.org
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (16:43) @Cheryl: wasn't meant as a criticism of Australians (just happened to be a topical issue). Other governments also have ideas/legislation that could benefit from "neutral" information.
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (16:43) But, everyone might have different ideas on what exactly is "neutral".
Ā Ā Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@CLO3): (16:43) Ohh it is well worth critisising @George, but I was noting we did not need to use ICANN.org in the process
Ā Ā Evin ErdoÄdu: (16:43) Thank you, Leon!
Ā Ā Bastiaan Goslings: (16:44) Thanks, Leon
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (16:44) I think Apple/Google/etc will have more impact on that issue. :-)
Ā Ā Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@CLO3): (16:44) Thanks Leon
Ā Ā Alberto Soto 2: (16:44) Thanks Leon
Ā Ā Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@CLO3): (16:44) Yes OCL
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (16:44) EPDP phase 1 is done.
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (16:45) Posted today that Phase 2 planning/prep work will happen in Kobe:Ā https://mm.icann.org/pipermail/gnso-epdp-team/2019-February/001760.html
Ā Ā Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@CLO3): (16:47) the GNSO Council WILL vote on the Phase 1 Final Report on Monday 4th, and has a discussion item open to follow that vote (associated with the Vote motion)Ā Ā regarding Phase 2Ā
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (16:48) There will be a public comment period before the ICANN Board votes on it.Ā
Ā Ā Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@CLO3): (16:48) Fingers crossed they can stay on in Phase 2 work
Ā Ā Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@CLO3): (16:48) Yes @ George that is as usual...Ā
Ā Ā Jonathan Zuck: (16:48) no kidding!
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (16:49) @Cheryl: will At-Large file a public comment for that, or just rely on its statements within the final report?
Ā Ā Bastiaan Goslings: (16:49) wow that sounds like it was a full time job!
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (16:49) (individuals can always comment on their own, of course)
Ā Ā Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@CLO3): (16:50) Oh indeedĀ Ā the E part of EPDP is intensive and demands extraordinary commitments from its volunteers from COmmunity
Ā Ā hadia Elminiawi: (16:51) EPDP Sunday meeting is at 17:00 -18:30
Ā Ā Alberto Soto 2: (16:51) That dedicated time is similar to the At-Large review ...
Ā Ā Maureen Hilyard: (16:52) We would be very lucky to be able to retain both Alan and Hadia on the EPDPĀ
Ā Ā Alberto Soto 2: (16:53) I agree Maureen
Ā Ā Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@CLO3): (16:53) With our activities in somewhat of a state of flux, we are writing to let you know that we plan to maintain most of the Kobe meeting schedule. During a call with GNSO Council leadership, we agreed to use the opportunity for planning and prep work for Phase 2, while waiting for any additional GNSO Council instructions.We will use the Saturday meeting slot for Phase 2 planning, and a discussion on how to manage the coincident Implementation and Phase 2 efforts. We will plan to start Saturday at 11AM and spend 60-90 minutes reviewing GNSO Council decisions and guidance, take some early input from each group and set meeting objectives. Weāll break for lunch and continue through the afternoon until 18:30. We are hoping to provide some recreative refreshments around 1700 or so. We currently have meeting slots reserved at Sunday 1700-1830; Wednesday 1030-1200; Thursday 0830-1015.Ā Ā It is likely that we will meet the Technical Study Group either Sunday or Wednesday depending on their availability. Thursday, we willĀ
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (16:53)Ā https://mm.icann.org/pipermail/gnso-epdp-team/2019-February/001760.html
Ā Ā Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@CLO3): (16:53) from the message from Kurt
Ā Ā hadia Elminiawi: (16:53) ok
Ā Ā hadia Elminiawi: (16:54) I sent an email to the CPWG about the kobe meetings
Ā Ā Evin ErdoÄdu: (16:55) Thanks Hadia
Ā Ā hadia Elminiawi: (16:55) :)
Ā Ā Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@CLO3): (16:56) Not disagreeing on that Alan, just trying to manage expectations
Ā Ā Maureen Hilyard: (16:57) tend another non-ICANN meeting
Ā Ā Maureen Hilyard: (16:57) apologies I have to leave to attend another (non-ICANN) meeting
Ā Ā Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@CLO3): (16:57) We usually don't comment on LGR's
Ā Ā Evin ErdoÄdu: (16:58) See: ICANN64 agenda for Sunday, 10 March -Ā https://icann-community.atlassian.net/wiki/x/tQfwBQ
Ā Ā Evin ErdoÄdu: (16:58) Thank you @Maureen, noted
Ā Ā Yrjƶ LƤnsipuro: (16:58) I have to leave. Bye!
Ā Ā Evin ErdoÄdu: (16:58) Thank you Yrjƶ
Ā Ā Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@CLO3): (16:58) Bye @Maureen
Ā Ā Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@CLO3): (16:59) Bye Yrio
Ā Ā Alan Greenberg: (17:00) Who from NCSG?
Ā Ā judith hellerstein: (17:00) sorry I have to leave for auction proceeds
Ā Ā Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@CLO3): (17:00) Bye Judith
Ā Ā hadia Elminiawi: (17:01) Bye Judith
Ā Ā Bartlett Morgan: (17:02) i like the proposals generally
Ā Ā Alan Greenberg: (17:02) Off to Auctions...
Ā Ā A-Eduardo: (17:03) Bye
Ā Ā Abdeldjalil Bachar Bong: (17:03)Ā https://meetings.icann.org/en/kobe64-prep-week
Ā Ā Evin ErdoÄdu: (17:03) Thanks Abdeldjalil
Ā Ā Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@CLO3): (17:08) ahh but letting actual facts get in the way of a 'good' story OCL ;-)
Ā Ā Alberto Soto 2: (17:08) Thanks, bye bye!!
Ā Ā Antonio Medina GĆ³mez ACUI: (17:08) thanks.
Ā Ā Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@CLO3): (17:09) I am NOT be available next week
Ā Ā Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@CLO3): (17:09) on a plane
Ā Ā Jonathan Zuck: (17:09) I'll be travelling
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (17:09) Is there any pressing topic next week? (likely no new topics that we didn't cover today)
Ā Ā Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@CLO3): (17:09) so people can phineĀ Ā OCL directly ;-)
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (17:11) Thanks Olivier.
Ā Ā Evin ErdoÄdu: (17:11) I will unfortunately be unavailable next Wednesday.
Ā Ā Evin ErdoÄdu: (17:12) But can help with prep as needed
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (17:12) Elon Musk on meetings:Ā https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.entrepreneur.com_article_312247&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=mrDeztziKLa7gZqGADzxcnHA3QXmXYsnChWYBR4NElI&m=MIuCqfEB5Xj-Wwo1B5LgQG1hcLuu8DeM2JsU1oMWq4I&s=k07842F4Aju46HfiFZYIllgzu-KFOS5Xxe8A7SaDLVA&e=Ā Ā :-)
Ā Ā Evin ErdoÄdu: (17:12) Will do
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (17:12) "āExcessive meetings are the blight of big companies and almost always get worse over time. Please get of [sic] all large meetings, unless youāre certain they are providing value to the whole audience, in which case keep them very short,ā
Ā Ā Evin ErdoÄdu: (17:12) Thank you all!
Ā Ā Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@CLO3): (17:12) Bye
Ā Ā hadia Elminiawi: (17:12) thank you all bye
Ā Ā Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@CLO3): (17:12) Safe TravelsĀ
Ā Ā George Kirikos: (17:12) Bye folks!Ā
Ā Ā hadia Elminiawi: (17:12) safe travels
Ā Ā Leon Sanchez: (17:12) thanks everyone
Ā Ā Gordon Chillcott: (17:13) TYhanks and bye for now.
Ā Ā Abdulkarim: (17:13) bye