AC Chat: 2018-12-05 Consolidated Policy Working Group Call
- Yesim Saglam
- Aleksey Khapchenko
Yesim Nazlar: (12/5/2018 15:06) Welcome to the At-Large Consolidated Policy Working Group (CPWG) Call taking place on Wednesday, 05 December 2018 at 13:00 UTC
Yesim Nazlar: (15:06) Agenda: https://icann-community.atlassian.net/wiki/x/kfnvBQ
Evin Erdogdu: (15:44) Hello all, welcome
Abdalmonem Galila ( Egypt ): (15:45) Hello Evin
Evin Erdogdu: (15:50) Hi Abdalmonem!
Maureen Hilyard: (15:56) Hi everyone - using chat only today
Evin Erdogdu: (15:56) Hello Maureen, welcome and noted.
hadia Elminiawi: (15:59) hello all
Alberto Soto: (16:00) Hello eveyone froBuenos Aires!
Abdalmonem Galila ( Egypt ): (16:02) Hello Alberto from Egypt
Abdalmonem Galila ( Egypt ): (16:02) No problem to wait couple of minutes
Lilian Ivette De Luque: (16:03) Hello Alberto and Abdalmonem and all
Abdalmonem Galila ( Egypt ): (16:04) @Lilian my boss, pleased to meet you every webinar
Alberto Soto: (16:06) Hola Lilian!
Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@clo3): (16:07) Hi all sorry to be late I was in a call with the GAC
Yesim Nazlar: (16:08) Welcome Cheryl, we've just started
Abdalmonem Galila ( Egypt ): (16:09) <Comment>I think it is importnat to have an organization field if the domain name owned by an organization only not by user</Comment>
Abdalmonem Galila ( Egypt ): (16:11) <Comment> May be optional if the domain owned by user </Comment>
Holly Raiche: (16:11) If it's optional, I agree with Marita - I don't see a problem
Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@clo3): (16:12) Important to show our view though and clearly Back what Alan and Hadia have obviously been saying
Jonathan Zuck: (16:13) Sounds like a "give an inch take a mile" kind of situation
Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@clo3): (16:15) not a whole lot
A-Eduardo Diaz: (16:15) But if optional people may or may not put anything there.
A-Eduardo Diaz: (16:15) So it is a flush
hadia Elminiawi: (16:16) the EPDB recently released guidelines on the geographical reach of GDPR. See, https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__edpb.europa.eu_our-2Dwork-2Dtools_public-2Dconsultations_2018_guidelines-2D32018-2Dterritorial-2Dscope-2Dgdpr-2Darticle-2D3-5Fen&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=mrDeztziKLa7gZqGADzxcnHA3QXmXYsnChWYBR4NElI&m=-K8EVD3CiKA0lEpzTAs4YRVQjgFX_8NUOT-JDWErNF0&s=ifcCKLgAlE4yzXW4zz5XyyRNnMbUvMnmjJnuj4vG32E&e= and https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__edpb.europa.eu_sites_edpb_files_consultation_edpb-5Fguidelines-5F3-5F2018-5Fterritorial-5Fscope-5Fen.pdf&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=mrDeztziKLa7gZqGADzxcnHA3QXmXYsnChWYBR4NElI&m=-K8EVD3CiKA0lEpzTAs4YRVQjgFX_8NUOT-JDWErNF0&s=emKxO03zbSw8uPZCyFzwfJ-ycDQugnDONMEs0mWdLbE&e= .
Maureen Hilyard: (16:18) Hadia are these the articles that Alan is referring to?
hadia Elminiawi: (16:18) yes
Maureen Hilyard: (16:18) thank you
Lilian Ivette De Luque: (16:19) thanks Hadia for to share
hadia Elminiawi: (16:19) you are most welcome
Jonathan Zuck: (16:20) let's do it!
Jonathan Zuck: (16:21) I'm a fan of supporting the SSAC
Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@clo3): (16:22) :-) @Marita
Jonathan Zuck: (16:23) It's not our job to eliminate all liability from the contracted parties
hadia Elminiawi: (16:23) The guidelines in relation to the geographical reach were released on 16 November 2018 by the EDPB
Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond: (16:24) I think that a dark whois - ie. with no information whatsoever about the registrant, will definitely not fly with the GAC
Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond: (16:25) nor any government out there
Jonathan Zuck: (16:26) agree
Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond: (16:26) I have concerns that if the EPDP ends up with a completely anonymous whois, ths is going to discredit ICANN altogether, especially in the age of terrorism, hate speech, fake news etc. the current emphasis is aout trust, and anonymous domain names are definitely not trustful
Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond: (16:26) some people on the EPDP need to live in the real world.
Abdalmonem Galila ( Egypt ): (16:27) agree with Olivier
Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@clo3): (16:28) and Thanks Alan.Hadia
hadia Elminiawi: (16:29) @Olivier the registries and registrars now have the opportunity to make policy along with ICANN in relation to the laws and regulations if they fail to do that they need to remember Macron's statement - others will do attempt to take over
Maureen Hilyard: (16:29) Yes we can hear you Justine
hadia Elminiawi: (16:29) we hear you well justine
Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond: (16:32) @Hadia: I do not care if Registries and Registrars end up ebing regulated nationally in each country. What I object to is the discreditation of ICANN. If we do not fight tooth and nail, if we fail, then it's ICANN that will pay the price, because none of us can reasonably stand in front of a government and say that the multistakeholder model works and produces rational results that defend Internet users
Yesim Nazlar: (16:32) You may find the presentation here: https://icann-community.atlassian.net/wiki/x/kfnvBQ
Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond: (16:32) the irresponsible attitude of the few is pulling everything down
Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@clo3): (16:37) Yes that is an intreging idea I personally find it apealing though it still means deep pockets helps
Holly Raiche: (16:38) Agree with CLO - in the end, it is about deep pockets. However, JZ making some good points.
Maureen Hilyard: (16:38) I agree Cheryl
Evin Erdogdu: (16:38) Sure Justine
Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@clo3): (16:38) But I note we had not got to that 'Other types of Actions yet JZ ;-)
Holly Raiche: (16:39) I note the point that most are setled by negotiations - which is preferable?
Jonathan Zuck: (16:39) it's on the slide
Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@clo3): (16:40) but we were only up to 2.1.c.2
Holly Raiche: (16:40) The issue with random draws is that there can not then be consideration of the merits of applicants
Jonathan Zuck: (16:43) the vickery auction would only take place AFTER other types of evalutation have failed to address the contention
Marita Moll: (16:43) re: vicary -- I do find it intriging as well -- as a last resort -- rather than the regular action route
Jonathan Zuck: (16:44) it's still a last resort but the numbers are submitted up front and the money goes to ICANN
Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@clo3): (16:44) These are all methods for Last Resort
Evin Erdogdu: (16:45) Thank you and noted @Justine, we will also have the transcript and recording circulated after the call.
Jonathan Zuck: (16:47) everything favors money except the specific exceptions we come up with such as CPE, etc.
Dev Anand Teelucksingh: (16:47) have to leave the call - will review the transcript
Dev Anand Teelucksingh: (16:47) take care all
Holly Raiche: (16:47) I thought you were saying auctions as a LAST resort. Are you asking for other allocation methods BEFORE auctions?
Yesim Nazlar: (16:47) Thanks for joining Dev
Jonathan Zuck: (16:48) yup, scary
Jonathan Zuck: (16:50) we don't want 'em
Holly Raiche: (16:51) I lilke what Justine has psoposed
Jonathan Zuck: (16:52) lets get rid of all that
Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond: (16:52) Private auctions, in my opinion are pure business of speculation.
Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond: (16:52) They should be disallowed altogether as they are a blatant case of "mae money fast"
Holly Raiche: (16:53) to clarify - I agree with concerns expressed and we should oppose
Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond: (16:53) private auctions to not serve ICANN nor end users at all.
Maureen Hilyard: (16:53) It would be easy to abuse the system in private auctions.
judith hellerstein: (16:54) I agree with Olivier. we should not support private auctions
Jonathan Zuck: (16:54) the problem is enforcement. the beauty of the vickery thing is that they never get the chance to do this
Maureen Hilyard: (16:55) No support for private auctions and buying off other bidders
Jonathan Zuck: (16:55) exactly
Jonathan Zuck: (16:56) it's just a practice we don't support
Jonathan Zuck: (16:56) not abuse
Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond: (16:57) the "make money fast" culture is exactly what we want to avoid as this does NOT serve end users
hadia Elminiawi: (16:57) +1 to not supporting private auctions
Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond: (17:01) @Alan: what benefit to end users is there to applicants working with each other?
Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@clo3): (17:02) indeed JZ
Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond: (17:02) there are a million ways to get around a hurdle, but a direct path to speculation should be avoided
hadia Elminiawi: (17:02) I don't see any hands
Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@clo3): (17:02) I see no hand
Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@clo3): (17:03) No it is not Tijani
judith hellerstein: (17:03) I see no hands either
hadia Elminiawi: (17:03) @Tijani maybe there is a delay at your end
Alan Greenberg: (17:04) @Olivier, I think the Internet user benefits from innovative ideas and not prely allowing the richest companies to prevail. Working together has a better "smell" than just auctioning.
Jonathan Zuck: (17:06) someone need to mute their line
hadia Elminiawi: (17:06) yes justine but never mind we can hear you well
Holly Raiche: (17:07) On private resolutions, I am not convinced they are necessarily bad. How are they detected anyway
Abdalmonem Galila ( Egypt ): (17:09) <Comment>I agree with the proposed response for Q6</COmment>
Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond: (17:09) I am hearing Marita very well
Justine Chew: (17:11) Evin - if you can help identify consensus on any of the positions, that will be helpful, thanks,
Alan Greenberg: (17:11) @Tijani, we learned in the last round that "communities" may not be universally identifiable.
Holly Raiche: (17:12) Agree with JZ - if the applicant has wider community support....
hadia Elminiawi: (17:13) I see what you mean Jonathan
Evin Erdogdu: (17:14) @Justine will do
Jonathan Zuck: (17:16) marita what's your topic?
Holly Raiche: (17:16) Is that an issue?
Holly Raiche: (17:17) Agree with suggested response of support
Maureen Hilyard: (17:18) Agree with the recommended positions
Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond: (17:20) happy with that - I do not think that this is controversial
Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@clo3): (17:20) Yes a "Reply Period" makes perfect sense
Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@clo3): (17:20) MUCH better!!!
Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@clo3): (17:21) Let's power through
Maureen Hilyard: (17:23) agree
Jonathan Zuck: (17:23) no objection
Holly Raiche: (17:25) Agree
Holly Raiche: (17:27) I hope JZ and/or Justice are also looking at the chat?
Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond: (17:28) no objection to change request details as given on slide 18
Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@clo3): (17:31) contention not collission
A-Eduardo Diaz: (17:35) Need to moveon. Thnaks fo rthe information.
Alfredo Calderon: (17:37) need to leave. thanks for all the insights.
Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond: (17:38) I agree with JOnathan
Maureen Hilyard: (17:38) no comment
Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@clo3): (17:38) Phew
Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond: (17:39) This is great Justine! Thanks for working on this!
Holly Raiche: (17:39) well done Justine - plenty of work still to do but well presented
judith hellerstein: (17:39) yes. I also agree
Marita Moll: (17:39) Justine -- this is amazing work. Thank you
Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@clo3): (17:39) Huge THANKS for all your doing in this @Justine!
Maureen Hilyard: (17:39) Thanks Justine for this excellent work and explanation
Alberto Soto: (17:39) Thanks Justine
Maria Korniiets: (17:40) Thank you Justine!
judith hellerstein: (17:40) yes. thanks Justine for this
Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@clo3): (17:40) She is an excellent communicator as well as a quick study
Abdalmonem Galila ( Egypt ): (17:40) Thanks Justine
judith hellerstein: (17:41) yes auction proceeds is closing next week and so please send us your final comments
Justine Chew: (17:41) Next step for me is to draft properly worded responses based on consensus positions which Evin has (hopefully) captured and if not I will work something out. Will send another message to list asap.
Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@clo3): (17:41) I was going to raise the IRTP question as we SHOULD comment
judith hellerstein: (17:41) it closes in dec. 11 and it needs to be approved beforehand
Evin Erdogdu: (17:41) Policy Status Report: Inter-Registrar Transfer Policy (IRTP): https://icann-community.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/alacpolicydev/pages/102660547/At-Large+Workspace+Policy+Status+Report+Inter-Registrar+Transfer+Policy+IRTP
Justine Chew: (17:41) Are we calling for penholders?
Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@clo3): (17:42) We should and perhaps Holly might be well equiped
Holly Raiche: (17:43) I"ll have a look at the IRTP - I suspect it's about implementaiton since the policies have been discussed a couple of years ago
Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@clo3): (17:43) It is a Policy Status Report not new POlicy
Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@clo3): (17:43) so not overly complex in nature
Holly Raiche: (17:43) (and I was part of the IRTP WG)
Evin Erdogdu: (17:43) Lol
Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@clo3): (17:44) I remember that well Holly this my suggestion ;-)
Justine Chew: (17:45) @Greg are you looking at the one on new UDRP Service Provider? ;)
Justine Chew: (17:45) Oops Greg is not on AC :(
Cheryl Langdon-Orr (@clo3): (17:45) Bye for now everyone
Evin Erdogdu: (17:45) Thank you all!
Heidi Ullrich: (17:45) Thanks, all.
Alberto Soto: (17:46) Thanks. bye!!
Gordon Chillcott: (17:46) Thanks and bye for now.