When: Wednesday, 14 November 2012. GMT Standard Time. 1419:00 UTC / This is a 120 Minute Call.
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Adobe Connect Link: http://icann.adobeconnect.com/r1onj8cflqp/
http://audio.icann.org/gnso/gnso-igo-ingo-2012110720121114-en.mp3
On page: http://gnso.icann.org/calendar/#nov
The recordings and transcriptions of the calls are posted on the GNSO Master Calendar page:
http://gnso.icann.org/calendar/
Attendees:
Alan Greenberg – ALAC
Jonathan Robinson Chuck Gomes - RySG
Jeff Neuman - Registry SG group leader
Lanre Ajayi - Nominating Committee Appointee
Alan Greenberg – ALAC
Osvaldo Novao Novoa-ISPC
Chuck Gomes - RySG
Kiran Malancharuvil – IPC
Jim Bikoff – IPC
Catherine Gribbin – Canadian Red Cross
Brett Faussett – IPC
Kiran Malancharuvil - IPC
Donna Austin – Ausregistry
Osvaldo Novoa – ISPCP
Iliya Bazlyankov – RrSG
Christopher Rassi – Red Cross
David Maher – RySG
Donna Austin – RySG
Stephane Hankins - IPC
Elizabeth Finberg - IPC
Apology : – RySG
Thomas Rickert – Nominating Committee Appointee
Mary W.S Wong - NCSG
Debra Hughes – Red Cross
Thomas Rickert - Nominating Committee Appointee
Wolfgang Kleinwachter – NCUC
David Heasley - IPC
Avri Doria – NCSG
David Opderbeck - NCSG
Ricardo Guilherme - RySG
Evan Lebovitch – ALAC
Robin Gross - NCUC
Heidi Vanderveen – At Large
Apology :
Gregory Shatan – IPC
J.Scott Evans - IPCIliya Bazlyankov – RrSG
Paul Diaz – RySG
Christopher Rassi – Red Cross
ICANN Staff:
Margie Milam
Barbara Roseman
Brian Peck
Berry Cobb
Glen De Saint Géry
Julia Charvolen
Proposed Agenda – IGO-INGO WG Meeting – 14 NOV 2012 @ 19:00 UTC (120 Min)
1. Roll Call
2. Statements of Interest (https://icann-community.icannatlassian.orgnet/wiki/displayspaces/gnsosoi/pages/106790919/New+SOIs)
3. Determine WG Chair(s)
4. Review General Council Request – draft
5. Begin Exploration of Issues defined in Charter
6. Review 2nd Draft of IGO-INGO Work Plan
7. Next steps & confirm next meeting
Action Items – IGO-INGO WG Meeting
1. Submit Charter to GNSO Council - COMPLETE
2. Conduct WG Introductions / Review of Guidelines
3. Ready SO/AC Solicit Input Announcement
...
Berry Cobb:Welcome to the 7 14 NOV IOC-RCRC / IGO-INGO Conference Call.
Berry Cobb:Please note that this is a split meeting. We will cover IOC-RCRC for the first 45 min.
Berry Cobb:We ask only participants of the IOC-RCRC DT participate in the first session, but all are welcome to listen in.
Chuck Gomes (Verisign):I am on the call Ricardo GUILHERME (Universal Postal Union):hello all
Kiran Malancharuvil:Hi All. For attendance purposes, I'm joined by David Heasley
Osvaldo Novoa:sorry I got cut out. I'm back now
Osvaldo Novoa 2:I apologize for my duplicated connection, I have a problem with my laptop so I'm also connected with my iPad.
Alan Greenberg:sorry to be late. calling in now.
Alan Greenberg:as soon as a coordinator assists me momentarily.
Berry Cobb:http://forum.icann.org/lists/ioc-rcrc-recommendations/msg00014.html
Berry Cobb:We should just remove reference to UN6
Kiran Malancharuvil:I agree
Kiran Malancharuvil:That is correct Alan, the GAC request more than what ended up in the AGB
Kiran Malancharuvil:*requested
Berry Cobb:Schedule A contains the list from the GAC.
Kiran Malancharuvil:Thanks Berry
Kiran Malancharuvil:Thank YOU Jeff!
Berry Cobb:I will send out to the list later today the members of the WG. It will also show who has submitted their SOI and who has not.
Bret Fausett, Uniregistry:no objection
Kiran Malancharuvil:no objection
David Maher:I regret that I cannot participate in this discussion. Construction is going on in an adjacent office and i must remain on Mute
David Maher:I agree w/ Chuck
Donna Austin:What is the risk to the IOC of keeping the two groups together?
David Maher:What if every member of the WG joins both subgroups?
Kiran Malancharuvil:Donna - I don't understand what you mean my "risk," but the issue is one of time and resources wasted on revisiting from scratch an issue that has been beaten to death over the last few years.
Kiran Malancharuvil:David - would that be a problem?
David Maher:Not that I see
Kiran Malancharuvil:I agree.
Margie Milam:thats right-- that was the staff perspective....
Kiran Malancharuvil:Alan - the Subgroup A will expedite that issue and be done quickly. THey would not run parallel for long.
Bret Fausett, Uniregistry:I agree with Alan's point. There is a great deal of overlap between the subjects. Makes more sense to work just once.
Alan Greenberg:@ Kiran, all the more reason that there is no need to divide. But I am not at all sure that your scenario is how it will play out,
Kiran Malancharuvil:how do you figure that is a reason not to divide? if you bog down consideration of the IOC Red Cross issue with the larger issue on which much work is needed, how does that allow the issue to be expedited?
David Maher:I wish I could speak, but the construction noise would make it impossible for anyone to hear me
David Maher:that's correct
Alan Greenberg:@KIran, if the workload for RCRC/IOC is substantive, it will be a heavy load to have the two groups working in parallel, if it is not substantive, it will not slow down the overall work.
Kiran Malancharuvil:the susbtantive work has already been done Alan.
Osvaldo Novoa:I agree with the proposal
Bret Fausett, Uniregistry:I don't believe that all the work has been done yet. Even assuming that the IOC/RC are entitled to special protections, we need to decide what those special protections are and how they will be implemented.
Bret Fausett, Uniregistry:We use the phrase special protection a lot, but it doesn't have an agreed meaning yet.
Donna Austin:Is there an assumption that because GAC advice has been provided that means that the work has been done. Please excuse my ignorance on this, I'm a latecomer on this group.
Alan Greenberg:@Kiran: doing them serially or interlaced than will not be a problem.
Kiran Malancharuvil:Alan, we are like two ships passing in the night.
Kiran Malancharuvil::)
Kiran Malancharuvil:Donna - GAC advice is not the sole basis on our opinion that we have done the work. It's also the unredacted board paper with inside and outside counsel opinion, and over a year of discussion with the GNSO including presentation by both the IOC and Red Cross.
Donna Austin:Thanks Kiran
Kiran Malancharuvil:Why not say "the group can consider the following"
Berry Cobb:Just to point out. If we do not get the Charter agreed upon today, the next GNSO Council meeting is not scheduled until 20 DEC 2012.
Kiran Malancharuvil:What about: "Without duplicating work that has already been done by the IOC/RCRC DT, the group may consider the following."
Berry Cobb:proposed change.... "** Given commitment to expedite the PDP process, an effort should be taken to avoid duplication of past efforts with respect to IOC-RCRC"
Kiran Malancharuvil:NOT THE GROUP WILL
Kiran Malancharuvil:the group MAY
Bret Fausett, Uniregistry:We are going to AVOID the duplication of work and we MAY consider the Arvri list of subjects.
Kiran Malancharuvil:I want to see it in writing Alan, as we often duplicate efforts in ICANN.
Bret Fausett, Uniregistry:I agree with Alan's statement. I don't want to duplicate any work. At the same time, I don't believe we should cede to previous groups the policy decisions we are asked to examine.
David Maher:I agree
David Maher:I also agree w/ jeff's point
Elizabeth Finberg 2:I agree with Jeff's point, as well.
Alan Greenberg:@Jeff +1
Jonathan Robinson:@Jeff +1
David Maher:Not only am I unable to speak, I can only hear the proceedings part of the time because of construction noise. Sorry
Alan Greenberg:Will consider is good wording
Jeff Neuman:All - i need to drop. I will trust Chuck, David, Elizabeth and the other registries to speak for me.
Jeff Neuman:thanks everyone
Elizabeth Finberg 2:sorry, my call just dropped.
Berry Cobb:** Given the commitment to expedite the PDP process, the WG will consider the work and documents produced by the IOC-RCRC DT, but an effort should be taken to avoid duplication of past efforts with respect to IOC-RCRC
David Maher:I think Jeff dropped off
David Maher:are we going to consider the legal question that I sent to the group?
Elizabeth Finberg 2:I agree with Chguck. stop after the comma
Berry Cobb:** Given the commitment to expedite the PDP process, the WG will consider the work and documents produced by the IOC-RCRC DT.
Chuck Gomes (Verisign):We should consider the legal question after the charter
Bret Fausett, Uniregistry:That sounds right Berry.
Elizabeth Finberg 2:acceptable to me
Jonathan Robinson:I have to leave the call now. Apologies and thanks all.
David Maher:OK by me
Berry Cobb:** Given the commitment to expedite the PDP process, the WG will consider the work and documents produced/used by the IOC-RCRC DT.
David Maher:no objection
Berry Cobb:** Given the commitment to expedite the PDP process, the WG will consider the work and documents used by the IOC-RCRC DT.
Berry Cobb:** Given the commitment to expedite the PDP process, the WG will consider the work and documents used by the IOC-RCRC DT with regard to the IOC-RCRC terms.
David Maher:it's not part of the charter
Osvaldo Novoa:I can do it if you want
Osvaldo Novoa:sorry I have to leave now
Chuck Gomes (Verisign):David - are you able to talk about the legal request
David Maher:no
David Maher:It is different, and I don't believe the other review that Alan mentioned is worth making.
Berry Cobb:Brian, what did you want me to post to AC?
David Maher:All that will happen is to get a lot of conflicting opinions.
David Maher:The fundamental question is the one that the RySG has proposed.
David Maher:We know all we nned to know about the existence of the treaties and statutes. The question is whether ICANN is undeer any obligation under those treaties and statutes.
David Maher:+1 chuck
Elizabeth Finberg 2:I agree
David Maher:+1 chuck
David Maher:The unredacted opinion does not answer the qeustions.
Kiran Malancharuvil:because the term INGO is way broader than just the IOC and RCRC I think we do specifically need to cite the two organizations
Alan Greenberg:I am assuming that they do not know of such laws, otherwise we surely should have been alerted to them already!!
David Maher:That's a logical assumption
Alan Greenberg:If the converse is true, one must question why we were not told of them.
David Maher:and it would be useless
Elizabeth Finberg 2:agree. focus should be on policy.
Chuck Gomes (Verisign):thanks Margie
Chuck Gomes (Verisign):Thanks Brian & Berry all all
David Maher:+1Hello all. I'm here with Jim Bikoff and David Heasley.
Bret Fausett, Uniregistry:I will have to leave the call after the first hour, if it goes that loong, to attend the ICANN New gTLD Webinar.
Kiran Malancharuvil:nice try Brian
Mary Wong:Hi everyone, sorry I'm late (had another mtg in a different bldg).
Berry Cobb:Thank you Kiran. I had missed his changes within the email chain.
Bret Fausett, Uniregistry:Not to mention olympic.com.
Kiran Malancharuvil:Thanks Berry. Sorry for being a pain, but can you add the additional paragraph from the IOC at the end of Greg's changes?
Berry Cobb:Kiran, I'm having difficulty finding it. Can you cut & paste the first 5 or so words so that I may search for it?
elizabeth.finberg:The GNSO Resolution establsihing this PDP specifically asks us to address Red Cross/IOC
Kiran Malancharuvil:We were just disconnected, trying to reconnect
Berry Cobb:@ Kiran, got it now.
Kiran Malancharuvil:great...just found it myself
Kiran Malancharuvil:asking them not to duplicate efforts does not pre
Kiran Malancharuvil:*prejudice other organizations
Kiran Malancharuvil:it's directed to GC
Kiran Malancharuvil:that's fine with us
Kiran Malancharuvil:thank you Ricardo for suggesting an acceptable solution
Thomas Rickert:I am suffering from some technical issues. Just got a new router installed in my hotel room so I can at least access adobe.
Thomas Rickert:Can I have a dial-out again, please!
Thomas Rickert:My line was disconnected, too :-(
Ricardo GUILHERME (Universal Postal Union):"…taking into account the work previously done as well as any relevant information shared on IGOs/IOC/Red Cross Red Crescent…"and including IGOs below as well (.
Mary Wong:NCSG is fine with the language as is, though we take Ricardo's point.
Berry Cobb:Ricard, can you please provide your revision here in the text box please?
Berry Cobb:Ricardo. sorry.
Kiran Malancharuvil:yes, please provide your revision in the chat so we can see please.
Ricardo GUILHERME (Universal Postal Union):here it is: "...and research on the topic. be provided.."
David Maher:+1
Kiran Malancharuvil:that's fine with us
David Maher:+1
Ricardo GUILHERME (Universal Postal Union):so the beginning could read as follows as well: "....taking into account the work previously done (including any previous correspondence, determination and research on the topic)..."
David Maher:+1
Ricardo GUILHERME (Universal Postal Union):yes, it's better now
Mary Wong:Fine by us (NCSG).
Ricardo GUILHERME (Universal Postal Union):+1
Berry Cobb:v4.1 Adopted by WG of GCO Request was just sent to the mail list.
Bret Fausett, Uniregistry:I need to drop from this call and hop onto another ICANN conference. I will look forward to listening to the MP3 and reading the minutes.
Ricardo GUILHERME (Universal Postal Union):I second Alan's comment, which mirror some of my concerns
Ricardo GUILHERME (Universal Postal Union):I mean "mirrors"
Berry Cobb:Council Call is at 11:00 UTC
elizabeth.finberg:my call just dropped. dialing back in
Alan Greenberg:GAC advice is not binding on the GNSO. In fact, it is not binding on the Board, but if the Board chooses to not follow GAC advice, there is a carefully laid out process to follow.
Ricardo GUILHERME (Universal Postal Union):perhaps we can craft some language around that
Evan Leibovitch:Why is that necessary?
Alan Greenberg:Good question Evan.We all know that we reject GAC adviec at our peril. ANd we wouldbe foolish to do that without conscious action.
David Maher:I'm available on the 21st
Berry Cobb:Retreat does not equal a ski trip to the Alps. We're working! :-(
Thomas Rickert:sorry my line was cut
Thomas Rickert:since I cannot discuss with you now, I would like to NOT skip two subsequent weeks
Kiran Malancharuvil:that's fine with us
David Maher:I have to drop off. Sorry
Ricardo GUILHERME (Universal Postal Union):I must leave the call as well; thank you to all and have a good night (I am sending, to the ICANN staff, the proposed language relating to my first remark within the next minutes). Thanks
Mary Wong:Thanks, Thomas, Berry, Brian and everyone - talk to you soon!